11 Comments
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SUE Speaks's avatar

You've got a well-known predecessor, the late David Hawkins, writing about power over vs. power with, in "Power Vs. Force."

SUE Speaks's avatar

An oldie remark that I just found, but a goodie. I was a Hawkins fan and his idea did its job, where people still refer to it today.

Meri Aaron Walker's avatar

Yes, indeed… Power in the people… That’s the new party we need to make. Time to just say bye-bye to the corruption that fuels both the power-over parties.

Caroline F's avatar

Sociocracy is a good system to look into for application to our democracy somehow. My organization uses it: https://youtu.be/SMrurtlveiE

Doreen's avatar

Respectfully, the system whose time has come is power 'in' the people. A time to Master the matrix and reinvent ourselves. The results speak for themselves. https://www.ourgreaterdestiny.ca/p/human-operating-system-here-is-the

PEIOI's avatar

Liberalism requires a ruling class (power over). Decentralization is a liberal system and also requires a ruling class (power over). You CANNOT have a liberal system without a centralized ruler PERIOD!

Society of Problem Solvers's avatar

There is something called the last hand on the bat theory of systems. It sounds like you are not familiar with it. It states that top-down systems can exist safely as long as "the last hand on the bat" (the final say) belongs directly to the decentralized people. Our courts, our rules, and our culture can be set by the decentralized system, and enforced by employees of the the masses. It requires no ruling class.

Also, define liberalism. Bet ya can't.

PEIOI's avatar

Ill write an article on it. Then you can critique it. But, you will have to wait until after I'm done with the current article I'm working on.

PEIOI's avatar

For a preview, does a sporting event require a referee? Did the ruling class end slavery and prevent the Confederate states from seceding? Do constitutional freedoms need to be protected?

Society of Problem Solvers's avatar

A sporting event does not require a referee. In fact we could allow video replay, the viewers to be the referees using collective swarm intelligence, or AI referees.

Either way the refs could work for the fans instead of the owner of the teams. The power can be with the people and still have organized top down systems that work for it.

Patrick Sullivan's avatar

Authority and power are not bad words. I think consent is of major significances. If we consent to rules then we can have authority and responsibility-accountability as well. I don't mind having a "boss" necessarily... But the boss is the boss of a particular space, time and let's say event... Clare Graves did studies and found that people like best about leaders : polite , open and authoritative... That sounded weird to me at first.. but that not authoritarianism... Also the regrarians permaculture group uses "power of veto" ... Basically there often needs to be an accountable and responsible project management... And that's still not power over.... People still consent to the functionally transparent models. Again no problems taking "orders" from people , in fact generally I'd rather follow..

Just can't find anyone I respect enough too 🤣 in trying to be a leader but I find a lot of people want micro management - not on paper - but in actuality. I'm not prepared for that... Too strong Aquarius archetypal resonance in me 😂